Earlier this year, Saturnfive Founder Neil Burrows was interviewed by Ian Iceton at Buckingham University as part of a graduate careers session. Here is a condensed transcript of the discussion which provides some insight into planning and navigating a career. It’s not all plain sailing..

Ian Iceton (IC)  If we could go back to you at age 10 or 15, what did you think you were going to be — and how different is that from where you ended up?

Neil Burrows (NB)  Well, very different! Like many young people, I had all sorts of crazy ideas about what I would do when I was older. As a child of the Apollo moon programme, I had dreams of being an astronaut – which is a long way from being a business executive in the car industry. To be honest, I flirted with a range of what now seems like random career choices – Royal Marines Officer, professional session musician were some of the more varied options. However, if I look back at my teen years, there were some hints of what I might be good at and what I liked doing which have stuck with me throughout my working life.

IC  When did your career stop being a vague idea and start becoming something you were genuinely serious about — and what forced that moment?

NB  I probably started to think seriously about ‘career’ in my final year of university at Loughborough. A combination of the real-world looming and peer pressure triggered a more focused and methodical attitude. The early 1980s saw very high level of unemployment so it was a difficult time to be entering the job market. I took the job search quite seriously in my second and third trimester.

IC  After university, how did you actually make decisions — did you have a clear plan, or were you figuring it out as you went?

NB  I had a general overall vision but I was flexible in specific industries and roles. With an economics degree I knew it would be in a business or commercial field, but I wasn’t a numbers guy, I have always been a right-brain person. I was also increasingly interested in cars after passing my driving test, so my logic led me to search for commercial, graduate roles in the broad automotive sector. The final choice was based upon that thought – I had offers of better salary, some from very good companies too, but my first job at Peugeot UK was the best fit for me.

IC  How aware were you really of the range of career paths available to you at the time — and do you think that awareness (or lack of it) shaped your trajectory?

NB  I had an idea of potential career pathways – but it was a narrow range in truth. You kind of don’t know what you don’t know and careers advice at that time was quite traditional. Only later in my career, when I was exposed to different parts of the work environment, did I spot possibilities that I could have followed. I think my restricted awareness was also slightly self-imposed, to be honest, and based on where I was brought-up, family work experience, friends. My advice would be to take time to seek out what careers are out there that suit you – not just in terms of education and qualification, but attitude and motivation.

IC  What did you misunderstand about how careers work when you were a student that you now see much more clearly?

NB  Really, just how much of it is down to yourself. Organisations and companies provide opportunities and pathways, but they don’t look after your career. Route finding and decision-making are down to you. Don’t rely on HR. They have a job to do for the organisation, but it’s not to look after you! You need to take control of your own destiny. I don’t see career paths as linear – it’s not just about the next step up the ladder. Sometimes it pays to take a sideways turn to gather experience and perspective, even if it feels uncomfortable – it often pays in the long run. Also, you need to be present. Gaining experience, relationship building, developing emotional intelligence – these can’t be done behind a screen or on Teams meetings.

IC  How much of your progress has come from talent versus ambition, drive, and sheer persistence?

NB  Good question! I’m not sure I’m the person to answer that one 😊 I would say, in my case it was 40/60 in favour of drive. My wife would say persistence and stubbornness! I think natural enthusiasm and energy have taken me a long way. I would not have had the opportunities I’ve had without the base of a good education and some talent, but drive has been an important factor. The fact I’m still here, working is evidence of that, I guess.

IC  When you think about commitment, what has that meant in practice — what did you have to give up, risk, or tolerate that others maybe weren’t willing to?

NB  It’s an uncomfortable truth, but sustained careers and success require sacrifices. In my formative years – 20s & 30s – I spent long hours and time away from home with work, sometimes because I had to but mostly because I was committed to my work. That meant lost family time, leisure activities.  A willingness to take risk can be seen as a strength, but it has consequences too. Big companies talk about risk and entrepreneurship, but honestly, they are not really comfortable with it when it comes from their staff. Being the maverick can be uncomfortable and risky! That said, it has helped me in many roles over the years – though not all of them.

IC  Have there been moments where the input felt far greater than the reward — and what kept you going during those periods?

NB  For sure! The pandemic was a very challenging period for me. I had only founded SaturnFive in 2018 – the first two years were strong, much better than expected but then March 2020 – we hit the buffers and it was pure survival tactics for the next two. It was sheer determination and survival instincts that got me through and an attitude of “failure is not an option.”

IC  If you’re completely honest, what do you regret — not just mistakes, but opportunities not taken or risks avoided?

NB  Well, there have been lots of mistakes for sure! I have learned from most of them, but not all! Making mistakes is all part of the journey, it’s natural and part of building experience. My biggest regret is not starting my own business earlier than I did. Creating a sustainable business takes longer to build than you think for a variety of reasons and I feel as I’m now running out of time!

IC  If these students remember just one uncomfortable but important truth about careers from what you say today, what should it be?

NB  Well, two things if you don’t mind as I’m always for bending the rules

One: be prepared to make sacrifices to follow your dreams

Two: Education, and a degree in particular, gives you opportunity BUT don’t let it constrain you either. You don’t have to be a lawyer because you studied law, or an accountant because you studied finance.

BUCKINGHAM UNIVERSITY CAREERS TALK